Comments on: Facebook Stifles Debate http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/ Politics and world events from a moderately liberal and conservative perspective Mon, 06 Oct 2008 18:08:17 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.2 By: andre http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-55507 andre Thu, 05 Jun 2008 22:36:51 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-55507 im armenian, but im going to put aside the emotional factor in my argument and look at this from a more neutral point of view. ALL of this is just pointing the finger. no one is actually getting anything done. we have armenians claiming genocide, and then Turks claiming the atrocities caused by armenians around the same time. However, there is always going to be more speculation surrounding offensive commments made by turks or turkish-sided comments because Turkey has been so volatile during the 20th Century....siding with Germany in WWI,  the Pontic Greek Genocide of the early 1920's, in which 500,000 Greeks were massacred...and the involvement of Turkey in the Missile Crisis of the 1960's. thats why when the turks point the finger, they're usually dealt with much more harshly than Armenians. now, if i were to make a completely honest statement about all of this: Turkey & Armenia, stop acting childish, both of you, and make some kind of agreement or deal that will put all this behind us. im armenian, but im going to put aside the emotional factor in my argument and look at this from a more neutral point of view.

ALL of this is just pointing the finger. no one is actually getting anything done. we have armenians claiming genocide, and then Turks claiming the atrocities caused by armenians around the same time. However, there is always going to be more speculation surrounding offensive commments made by turks or turkish-sided comments because Turkey has been so volatile during the 20th Century….siding with Germany in WWI,  the Pontic Greek Genocide of the early 1920’s, in which 500,000 Greeks were massacred…and the involvement of Turkey in the Missile Crisis of the 1960’s.

thats why when the turks point the finger, they’re usually dealt with much more harshly than Armenians.

now, if i were to make a completely honest statement about all of this: Turkey & Armenia, stop acting childish, both of you, and make some kind of agreement or deal that will put all this behind us.

]]> By: Önder Cırık http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10474 Önder Cırık Wed, 12 Dec 2007 11:31:02 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10474 Shut down of Ataturk and Armenian genocide is a Huge Lie group are other indicators how Armenian lies go around the world very easily. You silence one side and let the other side speak. What would you expect! If Turks speak for themselves in any area, I give ten more years fro Armenian lies. Hikmet Sami Türk, who was a former Turkish diplomat, was speaking in a TV programme and he said, "I have been to a lot of alleged Armenian genocide discussions in European countries, we were allowed to speak our thesis once and it was in Belgium. Result: The decision did not happen as Armenians wanted at the end of the meeting and many Europeans left the room with a lof of questions in their minds. But I remember that they all came there to advise Turkey to recognize so-called Armenian Genocide." Shut down of Ataturk and Armenian genocide is a Huge Lie group are other indicators how Armenian lies go around the world very easily. You silence one side and let the other side speak. What would you expect! If Turks speak for themselves in any area, I give ten more years fro Armenian lies. Hikmet Sami Türk, who was a former Turkish diplomat, was speaking in a TV programme and he said, "I have been to a lot of alleged Armenian genocide discussions in European countries, we were allowed to speak our thesis once and it was in Belgium. Result: The decision did not happen as Armenians wanted at the end of the meeting and many Europeans left the room with a lof of questions in their minds. But I remember that they all came there to advise Turkey to recognize so-called Armenian Genocide."

]]> By: Lazlee http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10444 Lazlee Wed, 12 Dec 2007 00:41:55 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10444 "Well there was a hate group made by Turks as well but I reported it and now it’s gone- I think. It compared Armenians to gnomes and consisted of rants about how evil they were. " Gnomes, eh?  Boy, Michael, these comments are full of gems.  At least gnomes is creative, unlike the Armenian standard fare of calling Turks Mongolians, which in any event is inaccurate.  So what is it about Mongolians Armenians don't like anyway?  Mongolians live in Mongolia and are Chinese citizens as far as I know. The real point here is that hate only produces more hate.  At some point people have to stop, and if one side tries to stifle debate about a hotly disputed topic and calls people names, they will generate responses in kind.  Remarkably, there are all kinds of names Armenians call Turks, and no one calls them on it for the childish and ridiculous tactic that it is.  They call them "denialists," "anti-Armenian" and say that "they are killing Armenians again."  All of this just reminds me of the school yard--"you are a denialist!" "no I'm not."  "yes you are"  "I know you are, but what am I?" ad nauseum.  They even run after Congressional representatives who were against H.R. 106 shouting the same things. It's just schoolyard bullying, juvenile and ridiculous.  It is not academic, does not adress the facts or the documents.  Yet, it's a tactic embraced by the Armenian diaspora as a whole.  It's bizarre. "Well there was a hate group made by Turks as well but I reported it and now it’s gone- I think. It compared Armenians to gnomes and consisted of rants about how evil they were. "

Gnomes, eh?  Boy, Michael, these comments are full of gems.  At least gnomes is creative, unlike the Armenian standard fare of calling Turks Mongolians, which in any event is inaccurate.  So what is it about Mongolians Armenians don’t like anyway?  Mongolians live in Mongolia and are Chinese citizens as far as I know.

The real point here is that hate only produces more hate.  At some point people have to stop, and if one side tries to stifle debate about a hotly disputed topic and calls people names, they will generate responses in kind. 

Remarkably, there are all kinds of names Armenians call Turks, and no one calls them on it for the childish and ridiculous tactic that it is.  They call them "denialists," "anti-Armenian" and say that "they are killing Armenians again."  All of this just reminds me of the school yard–"you are a denialist!" "no I’m not."  "yes you are"  "I know you are, but what am I?" ad nauseum.  They even run after Congressional representatives who were against H.R. 106 shouting the same things.

It’s just schoolyard bullying, juvenile and ridiculous.  It is not academic, does not adress the facts or the documents.  Yet, it’s a tactic embraced by the Armenian diaspora as a whole.  It’s bizarre.

]]> By: Lazlee http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10436 Lazlee Wed, 12 Dec 2007 00:07:35 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10436 "The Armenian criminal of Orly Airport massacre, Karapetyan, a member of ASALA, who was set free from prison and returned to Armenia in May 2001, was <strong>welcomed by the then Armenian prime minister A.Margaryan and the Armenian people who applauded him</strong>. <strong>A. Margaryan told that he appreciated this hero’s service for his country." </strong>I almost missed this....so, what would happen if Hrant Dink's murderer was treated the same way?  I can only imagine.  "The Armenian criminal of Orly Airport massacre, Karapetyan, a member of ASALA, who was set free from prison and returned to Armenia in May 2001, was welcomed by the then Armenian prime minister A.Margaryan and the Armenian people who applauded him. A. Margaryan told that he appreciated this hero’s service for his country."

I almost missed this….so, what would happen if Hrant Dink’s murderer was treated the same way?  I can only imagine. 

]]> By: Alihan Kavak http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10434 Alihan Kavak Wed, 12 Dec 2007 00:01:40 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10434 Unfortunately, the uneducated will always root for those who play to their emotions; which the Armenians do so very well. For the layman who will undoubtedly not look into an issue such as the so-called Armenian genocide in depth, their judgments will always be made where emotion > facts. It truly is sad that a great group like the Ataturk one was deleted with no intensive research of its contents/members for no reason other than the amount of reports it received from the Armenians as being "offensive." Unfortunately, the uneducated will always root for those who play to their emotions; which the Armenians do so very well. For the layman who will undoubtedly not look into an issue such as the so-called Armenian genocide in depth, their judgments will always be made where emotion > facts.

It truly is sad that a great group like the Ataturk one was deleted with no intensive research of its contents/members for no reason other than the amount of reports it received from the Armenians as being "offensive."

]]> By: Hally http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10426 Hally Tue, 11 Dec 2007 23:38:13 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10426 I am member of this facebook group and if Turkish people post bad language it is erased like Armenian bad language.  Some bad language posts are put on Wall of Shame discussion-includes Armenians and Turks, many more Armenians than Turks.  Turks don't try to shut up Armenians at this group.  There is free speech for everyone at this group.  Armenian groups do not allow free speech to debate genocide claims, they have "shut up and accept policy."  It is Armenian 301. I am member of this facebook group and if Turkish people post bad language it is erased like Armenian bad language.  Some bad language posts are put on Wall of Shame discussion-includes Armenians and Turks, many more Armenians than Turks. 

Turks don’t try to shut up Armenians at this group.  There is free speech for everyone at this group.  Armenian groups do not allow free speech to debate genocide claims, they have "shut up and accept policy."  It is Armenian 301.

]]> By: Lazlee http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10424 Lazlee Tue, 11 Dec 2007 23:28:01 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10424 Excuse me, but have the Turks from Turkey or the Azeris shut down any legitimate blog group at Facebook hosted by Armenians? That's the relevant question, not whether people leave nasty messages.  There will always be people who don't exercise good judgment.  But, has there ever been an organized effort to silence Armenians' right to free speech by Turks on Facebook?  Clearly there is some effort being exercised to silence Turks and not just on issues relating to genocide claims. Excuse me, but have the Turks from Turkey or the Azeris shut down any legitimate blog group at Facebook hosted by Armenians?

That’s the relevant question, not whether people leave nasty messages.  There will always be people who don’t exercise good judgment.  But, has there ever been an organized effort to silence Armenians’ right to free speech by Turks on Facebook?  Clearly there is some effort being exercised to silence Turks and not just on issues relating to genocide claims.

]]> By: zekiye http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10410 zekiye Tue, 11 Dec 2007 22:51:43 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10410 <strong>Tendency of the Armenians to violence (whether verbal or physical violence) is not new. Note the following facts:</strong><strong>The Armenians established outlaw  terrorist organizations ASALA, JCAG (Justice Commandos for Armenian Genocide) and ARA (Armenian Revolutionary Army).  Because of their activities, 70 people died (39 of whom being innocent Turkish diplomats);  524 people were wounded; 105 were pledged.  These organizations performed 208 bombing activities </strong><strong>during 1975-1986 also. </strong>What did the American Armenians do when Armenian Yanıkyan,  who murdered the Turkish diplomats Mehmet Baydar ile Bahadır Demir in Santa Barbara, California and surrendered the police (and inspired the formation of ASALA afterwards) ? The Armenians gathered around the district and <strong>SALUTED the murderer!!</strong>The Armenian criminal of Orly Airport massacre, Karapetyan, a member of ASALA, who was set free from prison and returned to Armenia in May 2001, was <strong>welcomed by the then Armenian prime minister A.Margaryan and the Armenian people who applauded him</strong>. <strong>A. Margaryan told that he appreciated this hero’s service for his country. Armenian Yerivan municipality provided work and house for him (for a MURDERER).   </strong><strong>Mourad Topalian who was sentenced to 36 months in prison for complicity in conspiracy to bomb the Turkish mission at the United Nations had previosly been the chief of the Armenian National Committee of America. </strong>The Armenians  firebombed <strong>the house of historian Stanford J Shaw just because he declared </strong><strong>that ‘Armenian genocide did not occur’, in 1977.</strong>  Additionallly, the Armenians murdered their own Chairman of Assembly Karen Demirciyan and prime minister Vazgen Sarkisyan, in the Armenian parliament building, in 1999. Tendency of the Armenians to violence (whether verbal or physical violence) is not new. Note the following facts:The Armenians established outlaw  terrorist organizations ASALA, JCAG (Justice Commandos for Armenian Genocide) and ARA (Armenian Revolutionary Army).  Because of their activities, 70 people died (39 of whom being innocent Turkish diplomats);  524 people were wounded; 105 were pledged.  These organizations performed 208 bombing activities during 1975-1986 also. What did the American Armenians do when Armenian Yanıkyan,  who murdered the Turkish diplomats Mehmet Baydar ile Bahadır Demir in Santa Barbara, California and surrendered the police (and inspired the formation of ASALA afterwards) ? The Armenians gathered around the district and SALUTED the murderer!!The Armenian criminal of Orly Airport massacre, Karapetyan, a member of ASALA, who was set free from prison and returned to Armenia in May 2001, was welcomed by the then Armenian prime minister A.Margaryan and the Armenian people who applauded him. A. Margaryan told that he appreciated this hero’s service for his country. Armenian Yerivan municipality provided work and house for him (for a MURDERER).   Mourad Topalian who was sentenced to 36 months in prison for complicity in conspiracy to bomb the Turkish mission at the United Nations had previosly been the chief of the Armenian National Committee of America. The Armenians  firebombed the house of historian Stanford J Shaw just because he declared that ‘Armenian genocide did not occur’, in 1977.  Additionallly, the Armenians murdered their own Chairman of Assembly Karen Demirciyan and prime minister Vazgen Sarkisyan, in the Armenian parliament building, in 1999.

]]> By: Michael van der Galien http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10355 Michael van der Galien Tue, 11 Dec 2007 18:40:53 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10355 Sure Paul. Go on. You're good. Both sides, well, only the anti-Turkish side really, but both sides, yeah. Sure Paul. Go on. You’re good. Both sides, well, only the anti-Turkish side really, but both sides, yeah.

]]> By: Paul http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10353 Paul Tue, 11 Dec 2007 18:34:48 +0000 http://poligazette.com/2007/12/08/facebook-stiffles-debate/#comment-10353 Well there was a hate group made by Turks as well but I reported it and now it's gone- I think. It compared Armenians to gnomes and consisted of rants about how evil they were. Most of what we see now is the flavor of the minute which hasn't gotten around to being deleted yet and is not representative of the complete body of hateful people on any side of any arguement that makes up the internet. And the photo gallery at Huge Lie itself contains plenty of pictures and slogans which amount to borderline if not completely hateful, and certainly disrespectful, things along with virtriolic comments. I don't see what I or anyone is trying to prove by any of this- I'm merely trying to point out that there are hateful people on all sides and your notion that only Armenians are hateful on facebook is ridiculous. Well there was a hate group made by Turks as well but I reported it and now it’s gone- I think. It compared Armenians to gnomes and consisted of rants about how evil they were. Most of what we see now is the flavor of the minute which hasn’t gotten around to being deleted yet and is not representative of the complete body of hateful people on any side of any arguement that makes up the internet.
And the photo gallery at Huge Lie itself contains plenty of pictures and slogans which amount to borderline if not completely hateful, and certainly disrespectful, things along with virtriolic comments. I don’t see what I or anyone is trying to prove by any of this- I’m merely trying to point out that there are hateful people on all sides and your notion that only Armenians are hateful on facebook is ridiculous.

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